Hell if I know. I keep forgetting who I thought it was every other beta.SpoilerThe Ghost of Maray
deep spoiler...
deep spoiler...but gives me a lot of thought about other possible traitors. For all we know, it could be an anonymous person on the sunrider who is so deep in grief over the loss of cera city that he has lost his mind.
Forgive me; I didn't sleep at all last night. I am on my last leg of concentration.
We can only hope its Chigara!
Honestly, as my least favorite girl out of the cast she´s been getting more and more grating as the betas have progressed and the other girls have drifted farther and farther into the background. I guess I´m just a rebel in a world ruled by Chigara love 8) .
Ava is best waifu after all BMU.
We can only hope its Chigara!
Honestly, as my least favorite girl out of the cast she´s been getting more and more grating as the betas have progressed and the other girls have drifted farther and farther into the background. I guess I´m just a rebel in a world ruled by Chigara love 8) .
Your not the only one. Seeing as how I prefer her rival, Asaga, I really want to see how this conflict will resolve itself.
I haven't finished the latest one yet, but I'm still pretty confident on what I've come to, despite the good theories everyone else has.We can only hope its Chigara!
Honestly, as my least favorite girl out of the cast she´s been getting more and more grating as the betas have progressed and the other girls have drifted farther and farther into the background. I guess I´m just a rebel in a world ruled by Chigara love 8) .
Your not the only one. Seeing as how I prefer her rival, Asaga, I really want to see how this conflict will resolve itself.
Same here. I like her ryder for the abilities it brings to the game, but she's low on my like chart.
*Have yet to play beta, so my current top 3 most likely traitors are*
-Chigara
-Claude
-Ava
I'll be honest, Chigara is grating for me.
MoA practically forces you into her direction, though it's for planning for Liberation Day, it's still grating.
After the reveal, she was the very first suspect for betrayal, followed by Kryska, but the gap was wide.
After the reveal of the beta of Liberation Day, that suspicion is switched to Asaga who has shown dangerous signs of turning for the worst.
However, Chigara is still an extremely close second. She's not off the hook just yet.
Though losing Chigara won't really effect me tbh, my reaction to losing Liberty will be "meh-ish" since I don't really use her much even in MoA. She tends to get shot down first anyways so I stopped relying on her abilities.
Losing the Seraphim however, will struck a huge blow, followed by Paladin & maybe Phoenix.
The traitor is none other thanSpoilerYours truly
Just as had been predicted so long ago!
BMU is salty~~
The traitor is none other thanSpoilerYours truly
Just as had been predicted so long ago!
My lord! How could you betray us so?! :P
I'll be honest, Chigara is grating for me.
MoA practically forces you into her direction, though it's for planning for Liberation Day, it's still grating.
After the reveal, she was the very first suspect for betrayal, followed by Kryska, but the gap was wide.
After the reveal of the beta of Liberation Day, that suspicion is switched to Asaga who has shown dangerous signs of turning for the worst.
However, Chigara is still an extremely close second. She's not off the hook just yet.
Though losing Chigara won't really effect me tbh, my reaction to losing Liberty will be "meh-ish" since I don't really use her much even in MoA. She tends to get shot down first anyways so I stopped relying on her abilities.
Losing the Seraphim however, will struck a huge blow, followed by Paladin & maybe Phoenix.
You're going to lose your Seraphim.
Chigara is innocent
I'll be honest, Chigara is grating for me.
MoA practically forces you into her direction, though it's for planning for Liberation Day, it's still grating.
After the reveal, she was the very first suspect for betrayal, followed by Kryska, but the gap was wide.
After the reveal of the beta of Liberation Day, that suspicion is switched to Asaga who has shown dangerous signs of turning for the worst.
However, Chigara is still an extremely close second. She's not off the hook just yet.
Though losing Chigara won't really effect me tbh, my reaction to losing Liberty will be "meh-ish" since I don't really use her much even in MoA. She tends to get shot down first anyways so I stopped relying on her abilities.
Losing the Seraphim however, will struck a huge blow, followed by Paladin & maybe Phoenix.
You're going to lose your Seraphim.
Chigara is innocent
"There is no such thing as innocence. Only varying degrees oflewdguilt."
The Codex of Waifu Warfare, Unknown Author
At this point it seems the most unreliable turns out to be Asaga. Then again all the lovely plot of "IS Chigara really a Prototype? Find out next time!" esque dialogue fits with a space operas Machiavellian machinations. Any or all of them could put a blade in Kayto's kidney if they really wanted to, lets be honest.
I don't really want anyone to be the traitor but here are my thoughts about that topic: WARNING!!
Quotedeep spoiler...QuoteSpoilerI think there ist one detail in the new beta wich made me think about it. Alice talks with an unknown Voice wich has warned PACT. She calls the voice "traveler". If this is an hint to the traitor (and i think so) then there are not many Girls wich can be it. For my thoughts it could be Sola. Why? She ist the one wich fits the term "traveler" most. It haven't be the Sola wich is on the Sunrider but one of her other
personalities in another dimenson. In Solas path in Sunrider Academy this subject was the main plot. It could be that one of Solas personalities came to this Universe and support PACT to defeat the Alliance an rebuild the Ryuvian Empire. She were the Sharr and want to be it again. This motive is also fitting for the actual Sola. So why not?
On the other Side Claude can also named as traveler. She traveld a lot before hireing on the Sunrider didn't she? But I cannot really think about a plausible motive for her. Asaga and Chigara are too obviously for me and it qould disappoint me a lot when there is no good plot twist in the end. We'll see.
But if i had a whish it would none of them. Then the traitor would be an alternative personalitie of Kayto... >:D
Mask of Arcadius says that the next installment was going to be called Rebirth of the Holy Empire. Answer: Once you play Liberation Day, you might just be able to find a surprise.It could be an hint of trying to rebuild the Holy Empire of Ryuvian. But is the person who wants this most Sola? Why not! :P
Ava is best waifu after all BMU.
Ava shit.
Chigara best.
Sola worse, but still gets an 8/10 on the moe charts.
Ava is best waifu after all BMU.
Ava shit.
Chigara best.
Sola worse, but still gets an 8/10 on the moe charts.
You got it all wrong:
Ava->Sola->...->Chigara->Asaga
Well frankly...Ava shown as the traitor would be most shocking and imPACTful.
Ava is best waifu after all BMU.
Ava shit.
Chigara best.
Sola worse, but still gets an 8/10 on the moe charts.
You got it all wrong:
Ava->Sola->...->Chigara->Asaga
My good man Douman... You have the same thoughts as I do. :P
What's this about?
On right picute is Alpha? I'll get her too as waifu
Ava is best waifu after all BMU.
Ava shit.
Chigara best.
Sola worse, but still gets an 8/10 on the moe charts.
You got it all wrong:
Ava->Sola->...->Chigara->Asaga
My good man Douman... You have the same thoughts as I do. :P
Are you saying that Asaga is above them all?
Let me end this, right here. Are you ready for this??
Sola has only been asleep for 3 months only. Let's just say, that by SOME miracle, PACT got to the zone before the Sunrider, and found the original Sola in the container, but then took her out, and replaced her with a clone and gave her all the memories of the original, and hoped that the blast would DESTORY the Sunrider and if it didn't, they had a back-up plan.
What if "Alpha" is the first attempt to clone Sola? What if PACT knew about Claude's whereabouts and lead the Sunrider to her with the assistance of the Pirates? They knew Claude would have info about the ship graveyard, and wanted to destroy the Sunrider because PACT knew the Sunrider was looking for an edge in the war.
Also, the resemblance: Check it.
Another thing, I superimposed the images. Sola's and Alpha's match, while Chigara's and Alpha's are off.
Ahh!!!!!! GJ! He's brought in evidence! What do we do?!
I think if Sola was the traitor, it wouldn't work with Arcadius. It was mentioned in MoA that he was very interested in getting as much ancient technology as he could. If Sola was working with PACT, I find it hard to believe he'd have left all the royal guard ships and the Sharr'Lac just sat there rather than taking them and reverse-engineering them to upgrade his fleet
Ava is best waifu after all BMU.
Ava shit.
Chigara best.
Sola worse, but still gets an 8/10 on the moe charts.
You got it all wrong:
Ava->Sola->...->Chigara->Asaga
My good man Douman... You have the same thoughts as I do. :P
Are you saying that Asaga is above them all?
Let me end this, right here. Are you ready for this??
Sola has only been asleep for 3 months only. Let's just say, that by SOME miracle, PACT got to the zone before the Sunrider, and found the original Sola in the container, but then took her out, and replaced her with a clone and gave her all the memories of the original, and hoped that the blast would DESTORY the Sunrider and if it didn't, they had a back-up plan.
What if "Alpha" is the first attempt to clone Sola? What if PACT knew about Claude's whereabouts and lead the Sunrider to her with the assistance of the Pirates? They knew Claude would have info about the ship graveyard, and wanted to destroy the Sunrider because PACT knew the Sunrider was looking for an edge in the war.
Also, the resemblance: Check it.
Another thing, I superimposed the images. Sola's and Alpha's match, while Chigara's and Alpha's are off.
And the fact she has only half of the sharr power doesn't fit with the ryuvan rules of DNA manipulation.
And the fact she has only half of the sharr power doesn't fit with the ryuvan rules of DNA manipulation.
I said before that it does fit, because the DNA manipulation isn't done in situ (if it was, how Asaga would have it?) but transmitted from father and mother to son. His mother being a commoner, Sola's DNA is only half "enhanced", thus, half sharr.
I said before that it does fit, because the DNA manipulation isn't done in situ (if it was, how Asaga would have it?) but transmitted from father and mother to son. His mother being a commoner, Sola's DNA is only half "enhanced", thus, half sharr.
The question would be, how the current Ryuvia, which is basically a state only by name, with no fleets, no technology and barely an economy, could modify Asaga.
Of course, you could say they still have a lost technology artifact to do it, but then it would have ended in PACT's power by now and we would face a sudden influx by super-soldiers (specially as the one who controls Ryuvia now is Fontana).
The question would be, how the current Ryuvia, which is basically a state only by name, with no fleets, no technology and barely an economy, could modify Asaga.
Of course, you could say they still have a lost technology artifact to do it, but then it would have ended in PACT's power by now and we would face a sudden influx by super-soldiers (specially as the one who controls Ryuvia now is Fontana).
The question would be, how the current Ryuvia, which is basically a state only by name, with no fleets, no technology and barely an economy, could modify Asaga.
Given how Fontana seems to harbor a distaste for super-weapons and unlike Arcadius seems to have some sense of honor (the dastardly kind) I doubt he would try to forcibly implement a super-soldier program. Maybe a volunteer one, but even then, he would probably cautiously explore the Lost Technology on Ryuvia, only implementing it after all the risks are known.
Given how Fontana seems to harbor a distaste for super-weapons and unlike Arcadius seems to have some sense of honor (the dastardly kind) I doubt he would try to forcibly implement a super-soldier program. Maybe a volunteer one, but even then, he would probably cautiously explore the Lost Technology on Ryuvia, only implementing it after all the risks are known.SpoilerRemember, this is the guy who betrayed the Prototype Arcadius when she tried to activate the black hole-spawning Paradox Core, it isn't a stretch (for me at least) to see him being equally wary of Lost Technology
I think that what Sola refers is that potentially any ryuvian can have the power of the Sharr, but only those on the royal family/higher nobility get the modification done.
And after it, because the Ryuvian work through a nobility system the modifications must logically pass down the line to sons. It's only logical from a feudal standpoint.
Also, if the sharr power was present on almost everyone, how would the gem even distinguish the royal family of the others to the point of differentiation between Sola and Asaga? I always supposed it was through the modified genes.
On Ryuvia's technology and economy, it's not directly stated, but heavily implied. At some point it's said that Ryuvia's ships are basically scrap, and their Ryders basically piles of scrap trying to imitate their previous figures but with a capacity a lot inferior than Even PACT and Alliance standard ones. From here, technology can be ruled out. It's also told that the court is a tremendously decadent one and that they have luxuries while the populace starves. Given that their fleets seem also to be very few in number, from those 2 I deduced that the economy must not be so hot.
Another important point is that Ryuvia is actually bigger and more densely populated than Cera, yet everything points a lot inferior in everything else (Cera's fleet was strong and cutting edge enough to actually be a consideration to PACT, and their economy strong enough to even be desired by the Alliance; Ryuvia is far below in both cases). I mean, while no economy and no technology are an exaggeration, everyone wants it only because of Lost Technology and its strategic position, while everyone else is a lot more loving with Cera despite it being smaller and less habitable.
I'm just going to say that a super-imposed image means close to nothing to me when Chigara is basically explicitly told as a clone of Arcadius (well another prototype in fact, but you understand) yet at the end of MoA they looked so different I even thought the theory was wrong.
On the theories: First, think. The one that passed information to PACT actually doesn't need to be traitor. I think that in fact everything points to it having been Chigara through her brainwaves either willing or unwilling. Second, one of the problems with this is the idea of traitor. I mean, if Asaga was to go mad with the power of the sharr, would it be really betraying? Why would she go with the prototypes she explicitly hates? Yeah, she may kill Chigara in an impulse, or she may oppose to whatever she is trying, but that doesn't explicitly mean betraying the captain. She is simply doing what she has been announcing all the time she's planned to do. Insubordination or even madness? Ok, but that's not a betrayal. I argued for something similar when earlier at MoA people pointed at Kryska: her being the betrayer doesn't really make sense, because betraying implies unexpectedly having been on the other side from the beginning. You can't be a betrayer when you're a known mole sent by your "ally" and always profess your total loyalty to said "ally".
Can you tell me where Sola proclaim that is forbidden for commoners? I think that I interpreted that she referred to the tittle (as in, to restrict the tittle of the Sharr only to those who have "awakened" and not simply the best pilot when there's no royal on the front-lines), but it's a case where the wording may be crucial and I might have misinterpreted something.
In the end there are four possible candidates for being the traitor with the possibility i think so far:
Chigara: 70%
Claude: 55%
Ikari: 30%
Sola: 89%
I think Chigara would be like Asaga too obviously and would disappoint me a lot. I hope for an big bang in the final and a traitor wich is not be mentioned so far. I think there are some points i forgot or that will be come to my mind later i'll add them in the discussion by time.
But for now: Merry Christmas everybody!! :)
Who voted Chigara? Raise your hand so I canThat'd be me - my waifu's are Sola first and Ava second. Chigara and Asaga never really stuck for me - hell, I actually find them annoying. Not that'd I'd wish them death or anything, but I'ma not necessary going to shed tears if something does happen (adjusts devil horns).slap some sense into you with my cannon andsend you on a little vacation away from home? You deserve it!
Also, on an unrelated note;Who voted Chigara? Raise your hand so I canThat'd be me - my waifu's are Sola first and Ava second. Chigara and Asaga never really stuck for me - hell, I actually find them annoying. Not that'd I'd wish them death or anything, but I'ma not necessary going to shed tears if something does happen (adjusts devil horns).slap some sense into you with my cannon andsend you on a little vacation away from home? You deserve it!
Plot twist.SpoilerEVERYONE'S THE TRAITOR!
We know that PACT has been getting info off the ship for a while now... but so far, I don't think it was ever confirmed that this leak and the traitor are the same or that they're even necessarily connected.
Take what Marx said for example - say that Chigara's Prototype Brainwaves or whatever you call them are letting the Prototypes spy on the Sunrider with Chigara unwittingly broadcasting information? That would make her the leak but wouldn't make her the traitor, since a traitor is someone who's knowingly betraying the people (s)he works for to help the other side. Therefore, it's possible that Ava might be wrong and the traitor may not be the person or thing leaking info - the traitor might be someone who's actions are either connected to, brought about by or maybe even completely unrelated to the source of the leak. It's unlikely but not impossible.
Quote from: Marx-93 on December 30, 2015, 05:12:13 PMQuoteCan you tell me where Sola proclaim that is forbidden for commoners? I think that I interpreted that she referred to the tittle (as in, to restrict the tittle of the Sharr only to those who have "awakened" and not simply the best pilot when there's no royal on the front-lines), but it's a case where the wording may be crucial and I might have misinterpreted something.
It's in MoA during the beach-scenes - she notes that the Sharr's were the best pilots in the Empire and often either born from or married into royalty - meaning that they would either be gifted (if such a thing is possible, though I assume it is/was) or born with the genetic enhancements that Sola stated in FA (First Arrival) were forbidden to commoners.
Of course that doesn't mean it's impossible pilot could earn their way up to that position and get gifted the implants after that point, but IDK about the social mechanics of the old Empire enough to make that claim with absolute certainty. However, if you NEED to have "Awakening", then that would indeed restrict Sharrs to only those with royal blood and the implants and gene-mods needed to make Awakening possible.
On the Sharr: it's technically a tittle marking the best pilot in the Empire (is thus always a woman, because on Ryuvia traditionally only women could pilot Ryders). That's also why Asaga proclaims herself as the Sharr despite Sola in theory still having the tittle and the power; she now is a better pilot.
The exact correlation with the "power of the Sharr" has not been explicitly stated (of course, the power could be the first and the tittle adopted due to the name of the special power, or the Ryuvians could have shaped that special power to the tittle). I personally think that while the potential in in every "modified" member of the royal line, it really needs an extra by part of the pilot to "awaken". This however doesn't require any machine, as is what Asaga does naturally during the story. But it probably requires to be out there, you know, fighting. Thus only the female pilots could reach that level (I suppose simply commanding a fleet won't work to "awaken" it). And well, with that power it would be trivial to reach the level of the best.
I'm with you in this point - it works with the modified genes. But we must make a difference between Sola and Asaga. If Sola's story is right she is 2000 years older and had a later modification on her genes to activate the Sharr's power. I'm not sure that Asaga had an modification. In 2000 years it could become to an evolution of the Genes. On the common side where no Sharr power was activatet the power stunted after the time. In the royal family where modifications where on the agenda much longer it could become inheritable. But it must be activated by an trigger. Asaga had this trigger in the first fight against the prototypes. It's a little bit like DBZ when Son Goku turns into an SSJ.
Final beta is out! And our question is answ-Spoiler...?Spoiler!
I don't know about you guys, but I was pleasantly surprised.
That was a terrible surprise.....
[Spoiker]Sounds like chichi is the villain, bmu. :P[/spoiler]
That was a terrible surprise.....
Don't worry BMU, all will be revealed on March 4... or will it?
Join us now for the True true final reveal in "Sunrider 2k23: the re-avenging"!
Just finished the beta (AT LAST!) The collection of events as a whole kept me constantly surprised. Can't wait for official release!SpoilerAnd can someone just...explain to me why the feels hit me so hard? Like, sure be sad, but I was more sad than I expected to be.
SpoilerI WAS RIGHT!!! IT WASN'T A PARANOID MADMAN'S RAMBLING!!! *tips tinfoil hat*
Actually, the Pearl Harbour incident had little effect on the US navy as such, as most of the ships sunks were in the docks and were easily refloated... and all the carrier fleet was actually far away from there.
I think Midway and the combination of deception and overconfidence of the IJN would be a better analogy of what you are looking for.
Back to the topic at hand: it was more of a theory I had but that had little to no ground to stand on aside from ... *I'll keep it in spoilers, we can discuss this extensevely in a couple of weeks, don't want to even hint who the traitor is yet.*SpoilerThe lack of information on some characters and my paranoid suspicions. And about hte doubt thing...I doubted, but most of all I doubt anything that is heavily hinted or is considered the most logic outcome.
Actually, the Pearl Harbour incident had little effect on the US navy as such, as most of the ships sunks were in the docks and were easily refloated... and all the carrier fleet was actually far away from there.
I think Midway and the combination of deception and overconfidence of the IJN would be a better analogy of what you are looking for.
Back to the topic at hand: it was more of a theory I had but that had little to no ground to stand on aside from ... *I'll keep it in spoilers, we can discuss this extensevely in a couple of weeks, don't want to even hint who the traitor is yet.*SpoilerThe lack of information on some characters and my paranoid suspicions. And about hte doubt thing...I doubted, but most of all I doubt anything that is heavily hinted or is considered the most logic outcome.
You see....you took my analogy literally and corrected me on history, for which (as you all know) I know little to none about...and the hope was that you wouldn't overlook the analogy and get the idea.
Remember, there is a lack of info on ALL characters EXCEPT Ava. Why? Because he had to make cuts. ._.
This INCLUDES AND IS NOT LIMITED TOActual spoilerClaude, who, btw, was the one who constantly examined Chigara and said "there was nothign wrong" and we don't know what happened to Claude yet. Ava found things in her holo so guess what?? She's in conspiracy as I mentioned before. LOL! XD
This INCLUDES AND IS NOT LIMITED TOActual spoilerClaude, who, btw, was the one who constantly examined Chigara and said "there was nothign wrong" and we don't know what happened to Claude yet. Ava found things in her holo so guess what?? She's in conspiracy as I mentioned before. LOL! XD
Just as you say, the last point in special was the basis of all my conspiracy/tinfoil hat theory. True, we know little about many characters background, and you already explained the reasons for it.Spoiler
But from some of them we don't even have a confirmed name , and origin and they don't seem to be in the databases either. It may be in my nature, but I trust the ones who seem more harmless and smiley a whole lot less.
And sorry as if it seemed as if I had overseen what you were hinting at, starting discussing the details of the analogy was ill suited.
SpoilerThat was the main reason I had for suspecting she was the traitor in the first place. Everything we had saying that Chigara was ok was from her, there was no third (or in this case I suppose fourth) party confirmation.
Controversial SpoilerWhile we're all talking about who was right and who's wrong on the guessing front, I'd like to reinstate that I think it's still Claude. After all, the reason Ava suspected there was a traitor is not because of some jealousy over Kayto causing a last minute turn, but because she suspected someone was sending messages to PACT about their location. Asaga might have switched sides for a bit at the end, but there's no way in my mind that she would ever try to get a then-enemy in communication to get rid of Chigara, when at that point the Arcadius sisters weren't even known about.
Actually, the Pearl Harbour incident had little effect on the US navy as such, as most of the ships sunks were in the docks and were easily refloated... and all the carrier fleet was actually far away from there.
I think Midway and the combination of deception and overconfidence of the IJN would be a better analogy of what you are looking for.
Back to the topic at hand: it was more of a theory I had but that had little to no ground to stand on aside from ... *I'll keep it in spoilers, we can discuss this extensevely in a couple of weeks, don't want to even hint who the traitor is yet.*SpoilerThe lack of information on some characters and my paranoid suspicions. And about hte doubt thing...I doubted, but most of all I doubt anything that is heavily hinted or is considered the most logic outcome.
You see....you took my analogy literally and corrected me on history, for which (as you all know) I know little to none about...and the hope was that you wouldn't overlook the analogy and get the idea.
Remember, there is a lack of info on ALL characters EXCEPT Ava. Why? Because he had to make cuts. ._.
This INCLUDES AND IS NOT LIMITED TOActual spoilerClaude, who, btw, was the one who constantly examined Chigara and said "there was nothign wrong" and we don't know what happened to Claude yet. Ava found things in her holo so guess what?? She's in conspiracy as I mentioned before. LOL! XD